I don't get it.

[lederhosen]

I don't get all the fuss about the 'Open Source Boob Project' business.

Don't get me wrong, I agree that it's skeezy and obnoxious and all. I just don't get why Some Guy On LJ being skeezy at a con is suddenly provoking such a flurry of posting, because my understanding is that there are lots of skeezy people on LJ - quite a few of whom go to cons - and generally it doesn't attract anywhere near this level of attention. If it was Orson Scott Card or somebody else famous (or even Brendan Nelson) I could understand, but not this.

(I think what this boils down to is that a lot of people seem to view the originator of the concept as a Somebody, and I've never figured out what makes him any more noteworthy than all the other folk on LJ who have opinions and aren't afraid to post them. Therefore I just write him off under the "lots of people are idiots" umbrella category.)

Comments

[ambitious-wench.livejournal.com]

What the darkrosetiger said. Word. Yup, yup, yup. *nodnodnodnodnod*

My breasts are NOT "open source", and the thought of guys waddling up and asking to touch them gives me the utter, utter, utter skivvy-skanky-squicky willies.

The thought occurs to show up at a con with boxes of padded bras with sewing pins pushed through from the inside and really, really big buttons that say "Go ahead and ask, cause if you don't I'll grab your hand and make you touch them!" and setting up a booth.

Yeah, I'm one of those bitter, man-hating dykes who had her painfully-milk-engorged breasts mauled by her father-in-law, and when I tried to tell him I don't like that, he said "Well, my son gets to do it, so should I".

Then there's Ferrett getting all dewy-eyed about the sacredness of it, the bliss, the joy of it (fine, fine, he's entitled to his feelings) and I'm sitting here remembering my bastard husband telling me "Don't make such a fuss over it, he just spent $XXX on our son, he's drunk, you shouldn't have made such a scene" and I'm getting really, really pissed.

So I'm going to shut the fuck up right now because I can't put together a coherant sentance on why it's such a big deal. But it is, Art, it really, really is.

[skwerlbuddy.livejournal.com]

Oh dear. *hugs*

[hpapillon.livejournal.com]

*hugs - but very carefully!*

The reason I state 'not such a big deal' is that it sounds like the idea they were trying to perpetuate was for people who were WILLING to be involved in the game (indicated by button), not the demanding of people at random.

I like the idea of people able to be silly, even sexually silly, in a safe place under their own control. The 'shared experience' of conventions allows people to do a lot of wacky stuff that doesn't compare to their mundane lives, and to an extent I think that's valuable. As long as nobody gets hurt and nobody is pressured into things.

I've only just found out about this whole thing and may be missing the particulars, I'm filling in my guesses from the cons I've been to - where, as I mentioned, people wearing signs indicating their willingness to touch strangers were not uncommon.

I definitely do not relish the idea of people being constantly approached by skeezy strangers and suggested to harassment.

[lederhosen.livejournal.com]

I get why the issue is a big deal. What I don't get is why this particular instance is getting so much attention.

To put this in perspective, look at the Bill O'Reilly sexual harassment allegations a couple of years back, or those against Israel's President and Justice Minister more recently. Far more notable people, and I doubt anybody here would argue that Ferrett's behaviour is worse than that alleged of these people.

But I didn't see my friends list explode about any of those things - I think there were a couple of posts about O'Reilly, none about the others. What makes some guy with a blog more provocative?

[trixtah.livejournal.com]

I think it's the fact that he was someone who evidently thought he knew better than those classically sexist wankers, and then when it was pointed out to him that while the scenario might not fit everyone in the universe, he refused to get it, despite his protestations about being all about supporting women's sexuality and blah blah de blah.

People always get at someone who is "one of their own" much worse than those morons who you have no hope of changing their mind. We know to avoid the Bill O'Reillys of the world - coming from someone, who again, should know better, it kind of is like being kneecapped from behind (to use an over-the-top analogy). Are all those "nice" "safe" geek boys at cons really sekritly thinking all the time that they want to feel up your tits? [I don't think so, or you know, only at appropriate times, but this moron didn't exactly give geek boys a good name... and it's hard not to generalise when you run across this kind of shit everywhere]

[nicked-metal.livejournal.com]

Well, once it was explained to him in coherent terms, he backed down, actually.

It can be hard to listen to someone when their rage is distracting you.

[trixtah.livejournal.com]

Hm, I noticed quite a number of explanations, actually, not all of which were incoherent before he changed his tune.

Personally, I wouldn't have given a toss if he'd said that it was a fun thing he and his (male and female) cronies came up with - it was the attempt to imply that it should be a universal thing that got everyone's backs up.

[hpapillon.livejournal.com]

And since I'm only hearing about it well after the storm, I'm mostly seeing the apologies and explanations and not any obnoxious insistences that everyone should love this, which is probably why I'm falling on the "What's the big deal?" side.

[nicked-metal.livejournal.com]

Hm, I noticed quite a number of explanations, actually, not all of which were incoherent before he changed his tune.

Yes, and I'm absolutely convinced that the non-incoherent explanations were a significant factor in him changing his tune. Not least because he acknowledges them in the bit where he changes his tune.

Personally, I wouldn't have given a toss if he'd said that it was a fun thing he and his (male and female) cronies came up with - it was the attempt to imply that it should be a universal thing that got everyone's backs up.

Maybe so, but a little personal context is here. This is the same man who talks about how a happy marriage is based on the same principles as a winning Magic deck. He's pretty much incapable of opening his mouth without claiming to have unlocked the secrets of a happier society. While there's generally a grain of truth in what he has to say, a generous helping of salt does not go astray.

I'm disappointed in the people who have been reading him for years (I know with certainty that one of the orchestrators of the feminist reaction was reading him in 2003) that linked to his post and screamed bloody murder. They should have known better.

[trixtah.livejournal.com]

I don't think he's Teh Ebil - I certainly didn't feel the need to go WAHHHHHH at him myself in his post (I mean, I think a few "do you know how this sounds?" comments were more than sufficient), but, hm, while it was an over-the-top reaction, if it makes a few more people think about over-generalising from a particular set of circs, great.

I mean, I've certainly done the same thing - linked to something eye-rolly - not with the intent for them to be buried under the onslaught and do penance for the next 500 years, but to alert my small circle of like-minded friends to the cluelessness. Unfortunately, these things can go exponential due to the nature of the internets and how many people the situation might resonate with.

I think many of us have had the experience of being disappointed by someone who thinks they are more 'evolved', thus the level of response (although continuing to pile in, after the first couple of dozen comments, was kinda redundant).

[nicked-metal.livejournal.com]

I have absolutely no problem with people expressing disappointment, I think that the occasional expression of disappointment is vital to a healthy relationship.

but, hm, while it was an over-the-top reaction, if it makes a few more people think about over-generalising from a particular set of circs, great.

Agreed. But the more over-the-top the reaction gets, the more likely it becomes that people will go 'I wish those people would shut up' instead of trying to understand.

[ambitious-wench.livejournal.com]

Because all of the people who are making it a big deal can't talk to Bill O'Reilly, or Israel's president or the Justice Minister. Because it's not just ferrett, it's all the other folks on LJ who can't seem to understand why the open source boob project is insulting and demeaning. It's because of the backlash against feminism has generated a backlash of its own, because women are sick of being told to accept this sort of thing and if we don't we're insane or over reacting or prudish.

It's causing one hell of a splash, and even those of us on the outer fringes of LJ are feeling the resulting waves.

[psychowoof.livejournal.com]

The thought occurs to show up at a con with boxes of padded bras with sewing pins pushed through from the inside and really, really big buttons that say "Go ahead and ask, cause if you don't I'll grab your hand and make you touch them!" and setting up a booth

Ooooohhhh! I'm thinking the logistics of getting another garment on over the bra would be a little difficult. Maybe shorter pins would work.....

[ambitious-wench.livejournal.com]

Nope. I'd wear it OVER my clothes.